Yeah mscott, we know where your going......extradited to America! :p
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Well, if they start coming up with bullshit laws like these, they have the potential for abuse. What overreaching laws are initially intended for is never what they wind up being used for.
First they get to take away our privacy for their own interests, then they get to use them against us as they see fit. Who knows what will happen after that? Probably what you'll see is a few sacrificial lambs sent to the slaughter in an effort by Hollywood to scare the world away from stealing/borrowing/otherwise demanding its productions in the way that *we* want them.
And that's just Hollywood, and they're just an example of backward corporations with too much money and a big stick.
Then we get the real issues. It wasn't that long ago that people were held by the US government for crimes that they didn't even have laws for, so they held them for years without any form of proper process. (One person's name is alluding me. Ed someone I think). Kevin Mitnick, well at least they wound up with half a clue, and he didn't really do any damage.
Then we got to see the Post 9/11 handling of "terrorists" at gitmo - regardless of how we feel about those people, their treatment wasn't great, and some of them went through it for a long time while their legal system dealt with them.
The US government really doesn't have a great history for dealing with people it knows are guilty of something, but they're not quite sure what.
How long before some 16 year old makes a statement on Facebook here about hating the US government, and a few thousand people jump on the bandwagon, even though he just said it because he was being a dumb arse teenager? Well shit, that snowballed on him, and all of a sudden he used the Internet to cause some form of civil unrest in the US. Shit hey, the kid's now labelled a terrorist, and they know how he is. And they saw some shit he was talking to his mates about how 7337 h@X0r he thinks he was when he apparently joined Anonymous in attacking a US govt website. Not that he really did of course. He just said that to sound cool, ya know, like 16 year old kids tend to do.
They just found their admission of guilt even if it was full of shit. By the time the kid gets to say he was talking shit, it's too late. His privacy is gone and his liberties have been taken away. If he really didn't hate the US beforehand, he sure as shit will hate them when they let him out.
This is true. However with CISPA it makes this an entirely different offence (not just pirating or Copyright infringment law). They can (according to my understanding of this law) now throw additional charges into the mix, such as internet terrorism, and "protecting the children" clauses. As you said it make abuse of the system a very real threat to anyone and everyone
well shit, i said crap like that when i was 16, (not long ago, but long enough), there has to be a line drawn somewhere.
This same shit is probly going to happen with our governments NBP (national broardband plan), they will then control the internet, they have the ability to see what we're viewing without haveing to go thru a 3rd party (telstra, optus) ect ect
This same shit is probly going to happen with our governments NBP (national broardband plan), they will then control the internet, they have the ability to see what we're viewing without haveing to go thru a 3rd party (telstra, optus) ect ect
Yeah DavidS I'm pretty sure you covered it too, but you know, just so it sinks in that this thing is a very real, and very serious threat to us here in Oz as well as everyone in the World
With all due respect to this conversation, as I'm not having a crack at anyone specificly here ok
I'm particularly old school, I do embrace technology, but I still expect my privacy to be protected at all costs.
This is regardless what bases of media, interaction, or with what nation I interact with.
Its only the people with the skill set and understanding, that would actually see if this is happening or not, and I'll admit, most of the time its the illusion that corporations and governments are adhering to policy. One would have to be colossally nieve to believe it doesn't happen daily, only saving grace is they tread in grey cause of the legalities of authority needed to pursue.
Now I'm witnessing younger generations coming up through the ranks. They have embraced technology and its gadgets like a warm blanket, naturally, sign of the times, so this is to be expected.
The thing that worries me about these new generations, is that as a whole, they openly give away huge amounts of privacy and civil liberalities, and stereotypically, are infantile to the underlying and often shaddy ways of the world . The real danger is they rely heavily and autonomously on the very media streams that can be controlled.
Corporations and governments used to work particularly hard on the information gathering front, now they must be laughing and sitting back with an umbrella in their drinks, cause this sh^t comes flowing willingly. These younger generations IMO will bring about global profiling to the likes we have never seen.
Add to this the docile doctrine, and even when there is something staining the sheets, 9/10 its too much of effort to make anything worth while happen.
In short, in reference to the topic, yes we need leaders with correct vision, and infectious optimisms to keep momentum within the sheeple (great word by the way;))
but I also believe this networking blanket needs a shake down big time. So my ultimate question of relevance is how do you reach the younger folk correctly in this regard?.
I'm particularly old school, I do embrace technology, but I still expect my privacy to be protected at all costs.
This is regardless what bases of media, interaction, or with what nation I interact with.
Its only the people with the skill set and understanding, that would actually see if this is happening or not, and I'll admit, most of the time its the illusion that corporations and governments are adhering to policy. One would have to be colossally nieve to believe it doesn't happen daily, only saving grace is they tread in grey cause of the legalities of authority needed to pursue.
Now I'm witnessing younger generations coming up through the ranks. They have embraced technology and its gadgets like a warm blanket, naturally, sign of the times, so this is to be expected.
The thing that worries me about these new generations, is that as a whole, they openly give away huge amounts of privacy and civil liberalities, and stereotypically, are infantile to the underlying and often shaddy ways of the world . The real danger is they rely heavily and autonomously on the very media streams that can be controlled.
Corporations and governments used to work particularly hard on the information gathering front, now they must be laughing and sitting back with an umbrella in their drinks, cause this sh^t comes flowing willingly. These younger generations IMO will bring about global profiling to the likes we have never seen.
Add to this the docile doctrine, and even when there is something staining the sheets, 9/10 its too much of effort to make anything worth while happen.
In short, in reference to the topic, yes we need leaders with correct vision, and infectious optimisms to keep momentum within the sheeple (great word by the way;))
but I also believe this networking blanket needs a shake down big time. So my ultimate question of relevance is how do you reach the younger folk correctly in this regard?.
Hi mscott,
Try not to look at it as "their" problem. Instead, try to look at every person on earth as a part of yourself. Don't look at nations as a different country, but look at it as land with water separating it. If you are not concerned about the politics of another country, and things like this pass, soon it will be in your backyard. We are running out of time as humans, and letting the corrupt do what they do is further separating humans from each other. We must always, no matter what, look out for each other.
i probly didn't add the bit in behind my thinking...
If we can defend ourselfs in say that fashion against it, then even if it does pass in the US, we have the ability to bombard their servers with the fact that its utter BS, also we would be able to make more of a push at our government to talk to them about it, as i believe it would be against their constitution, and ours.
BY the only way we can - we fill their channels of information flow with the information they need to understand what's happening, and what it means and keep jamming it down their throats until they wake up and realise that things are broken.
The younger generation didn't have to grow up with the cold war, with the Berlin wall and major unrest in the same way that we did. They just got to see some terrorists from some patch of dirt in the middle of nowhere being pissed at the western world.
They're not yet old enough to fully understand the world and what's going on, what it's history has taught us and what we know is likely to happen in the future.
Sadly, they are our future, and the world has got them so pre-occupied with their electronic toys that they're not really aware of the real world. They have all of this fantastic technology, and yet the best thing that most of them can do is type a shorthand message into Twitter. Our only hope is to catch them where they're focussed and repeat the message until it sinks in.
Bombarding servers is denial of service and it's not as efficient as it used to be. A lot of technology now exists to detect these kinds of attacks and deal with them before it impacts services.
The best you can do now these days is a brief interruption. Or you can find a weakness, take it down, and perhaps keep them offline for a day or two while they work out how you got in, and lets face it, you haven't really achieved much. It's great to send a message to those who you attacked, but once you've done it, you can't play that hand again.
Kinda like slapping a gypsie and stealing their hat, you know the consequences..lol
After reading 'vspec' s reply, I have had a thought that this is possibly something we have brought on ourselves (ourselves being Gen Y and X and our thirst for the coolest technology) in that we have abused the internet to such a level (who can say they haven't abused it :p) that the congress feels this is the best way to pull the reigns on 'illegal' activities. Let's face it, the internet is our everday life, whether we like to admit it or not, and it's human nature to find the easiest and cheapest method of getting something, especially 'something for nothing' so to speak.
I do continue to strongly agree that this is possibly the stupidest thing America has done, but with vspecs comments it does put that thought of this could have been brought upon by ourselves.
*Wait's for the barrage of replies*
I do continue to strongly agree that this is possibly the stupidest thing America has done, but with vspecs comments it does put that thought of this could have been brought upon by ourselves.
*Wait's for the barrage of replies*
The things we need to do - they're brain washed by the media and by technology to the point that they expect things to happen for them in the way that they want it, when they want it. It's a phenomena that's well noted within the tertiary education sector - students literally now demand to learn in the way that suits them rather than via the traditional methods that have worked quite well for a long time. There's some sad irony in kids thinking that they know better than those trying to educate them on how to learn.
Only way to get a message through to that lot is to put it in front of them and keep it there until their brains get around to processing it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not calling this generation stupid, but they are too distracted.
In one respect, yes I feel it has played a part B!
Dave also brings the valid point to the table. Being sheltered is half the reason.
I feel it goes a lot deeper than just a few generations bud. This is america we are talking about. If they didn't have a finger or two in every pie, and a few asses as well mind you, there would be something wrong.
This is a chess piece moved by controlling interests, nothing more.
Dave also brings the valid point to the table. Being sheltered is half the reason.
I feel it goes a lot deeper than just a few generations bud. This is america we are talking about. If they didn't have a finger or two in every pie, and a few asses as well mind you, there would be something wrong.
This is a chess piece moved by controlling interests, nothing more.
I think this was always inevitable. The Internet has always been that uncontrolled world that one day someone was going to want to control. The use (or abuse) is really not relevant. At some point someone would want to control it. China has already setup walls around its users to control them. It was inevitable that one day another country was going to do this - unfortunately it just happens to be the country that hosts most of the major online systems that the world uses.
Think of the very basic concept of how we communicate. International phone calls have always been easy to eves drop on. International mail can be intercepted at many points along the way. All of those things governments have traditionally relied on to do those things that they don't talk about. Now, we have a system for sending messages around the world at the speed of light and for the most part, without them easily being able to intercept the communication. The thought that governments would consider the Internet as a threat is not new. In the "democratic" world, they've just needed a catalyst to start putting these processes in place.
Remember, it wasn't that long ago that our own country was talking about enforcing censorship on us (again). They were telling us it was to stop child porn, though it would also block "extreme" porn. The list would be kept secret, yet would have to be enforced by ISPs, and it would be a process for someone added to it to get a legitimate site off the list (think hacked sites). It was widely panned by those of us that understand the technology as a stupid move. Easy to bypass, and would come with significant performance trade offs. It would also give our government a mechanism to stop us from accessing information. What if our next government is the Family First party - a party comprised of a lot of Assembly of God followers? What stops them quietly censoring things that they don't agree with? Can we trust them to not enforce their sense of morality on the rest of us?
A lot of these points were also brought up in the censorship debate.
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