Reef Discussion
Thanks @OSCAR85
A while ago I was exploring the usability for this salt as as many know, you can use many household or plain labelled products in your marine tank, e.g. epsom salts, bi-carb soda.
I called the company that makes it who advised me that there was nothing added or modified to it, and it was 100% naturally evaporated sea salt. They said to be sure, there would be 'SP' printed down the sides to indicate this.
Jeremy calculated how much I'd need to bring water to 1.025 salinity and we made it up by just putting into the equivalent amount of tap water, letting it sit over night and then shaking it a few times to help the salt dissolve (the salt is the size of rock salt FYI). We checked the salinity with a refractometer to be sure and then I used it for water changes for my nano and bigger display for a few months until I ran out of it.
Having always used NSW i noticed the corals only reacted if I changed too much at a time (>40%; they reacted by retracting in for a few days then returning to normal). Otherwise, no problems. I keep a large variety of corals in each system and have not experienced any problems.
Taking into account all the intense critters that are in NSW, we're planning to mix the artificial saltwater we make with this product with NSW for our commercial tank systems (@Morphology ) and my personal display. We then assume that those bacteria naturally occurring in the water will be able to populate the ASW thus making it more 'active' and 'better' for the biological balance of the systems (see http://dive-shield.us/infonewspages/Underthemicroscopejustasplashofseawater.html)
The CONS
- I see the main issue with using this at a hobby level is that it does take some finesse to get the amount right and to mix it thoroughly. It's not as easy as the nice fine salt you get in the 'marine' products.
- Secondly, there is the legitimate issue of contamination from being in factory settings, trucks and in bunnings. There was no contaminants or dust that I could see as the bag is similar to a large rice bag (pretty sealed but not impermeable).
We'll keep everyone updated as we use the stuff in our large systems and see what happens.
A while ago I was exploring the usability for this salt as as many know, you can use many household or plain labelled products in your marine tank, e.g. epsom salts, bi-carb soda.
I called the company that makes it who advised me that there was nothing added or modified to it, and it was 100% naturally evaporated sea salt. They said to be sure, there would be 'SP' printed down the sides to indicate this.
Jeremy calculated how much I'd need to bring water to 1.025 salinity and we made it up by just putting into the equivalent amount of tap water, letting it sit over night and then shaking it a few times to help the salt dissolve (the salt is the size of rock salt FYI). We checked the salinity with a refractometer to be sure and then I used it for water changes for my nano and bigger display for a few months until I ran out of it.
Having always used NSW i noticed the corals only reacted if I changed too much at a time (>40%; they reacted by retracting in for a few days then returning to normal). Otherwise, no problems. I keep a large variety of corals in each system and have not experienced any problems.
Taking into account all the intense critters that are in NSW, we're planning to mix the artificial saltwater we make with this product with NSW for our commercial tank systems (@Morphology ) and my personal display. We then assume that those bacteria naturally occurring in the water will be able to populate the ASW thus making it more 'active' and 'better' for the biological balance of the systems (see http://dive-shield.us/infonewspages/Underthemicroscopejustasplashofseawater.html)
The CONS
- I see the main issue with using this at a hobby level is that it does take some finesse to get the amount right and to mix it thoroughly. It's not as easy as the nice fine salt you get in the 'marine' products.
- Secondly, there is the legitimate issue of contamination from being in factory settings, trucks and in bunnings. There was no contaminants or dust that I could see as the bag is similar to a large rice bag (pretty sealed but not impermeable).
We'll keep everyone updated as we use the stuff in our large systems and see what happens.
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Have you tests after mixing of N, P, Ca, Alk, Mg etc ?
I googled the MDS it came up on Aquasonic's web site.
Pete
I googled the MDS it came up on Aquasonic's web site.
Pete
I wondered why this idea was not already somewhat a main stream idea, so did a little googling.
Solar salt is indeed made up from;
"Solar Salt is produced from either sea water or underground brine. The water or brine source contains a range of dissolved salts including common sodium chloride.
The ionic composition of sea water is as follows:
55.1%Chloride (Cl-)
30.6%Sodium (Na+)
7.7%Sulfate (SO42-)
3.7%Magnesium (Mg2+)
1.2%Calcium (Ca2+)
1.1%Potassium (K+)
0.4%Bicarbonate (HCO3-)
0.2%Bromide (Br-)
0.1%Borate (BO33-)"
The big question is when these elements precipitate out of solution when the salt is formed they may be in a composition that will not redissolve again, like calcium carbonate.
You really need to test for elemental composition after mixing some to see :)
Pete
Solar salt is indeed made up from;
"Solar Salt is produced from either sea water or underground brine. The water or brine source contains a range of dissolved salts including common sodium chloride.
The ionic composition of sea water is as follows:
55.1%Chloride (Cl-)
30.6%Sodium (Na+)
7.7%Sulfate (SO42-)
3.7%Magnesium (Mg2+)
1.2%Calcium (Ca2+)
1.1%Potassium (K+)
0.4%Bicarbonate (HCO3-)
0.2%Bromide (Br-)
0.1%Borate (BO33-)"
The big question is when these elements precipitate out of solution when the salt is formed they may be in a composition that will not redissolve again, like calcium carbonate.
You really need to test for elemental composition after mixing some to see :)
Pete
Had a quick look at a thread on masa and they really poopoo the idea! They believe that the levels the manufuctrarer of pool salt believe 'could' be present are far too high and dangerous, and that other levels are too far out to be brought back into line with a small amount of supplementation. They made some links to an analysis of pool salt water and found levels of copper to be ~5ppm and a few other points. Some people can be a bit brutal over there actually just for suggesting it :confused:
But that's not saying this pool salt is the same as the pool salt that they tested. And after reading about red sea salt (just the standard blue bucket). They just list it as evaporated sea water from the red sea with a slightly raised alk. I can't see the difference between this and pool salt besides a small buffering of alk!!
I think I might buy a bag (hell it's $7!) and make up some water and do as much testing as I have the kits for!!! Even if you mixed it 30:70 (pool salt:to reef salt or NSW). That could be quite the saving! Like I said it's nearly 15 times cheaper than what I buy my ASW for.
This is the thread on there: http://www.masa.asn.au/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=163790&sid=fcd67d5ef691bc49a3629722ed1e3d5c
But that's not saying this pool salt is the same as the pool salt that they tested. And after reading about red sea salt (just the standard blue bucket). They just list it as evaporated sea water from the red sea with a slightly raised alk. I can't see the difference between this and pool salt besides a small buffering of alk!!
I think I might buy a bag (hell it's $7!) and make up some water and do as much testing as I have the kits for!!! Even if you mixed it 30:70 (pool salt:to reef salt or NSW). That could be quite the saving! Like I said it's nearly 15 times cheaper than what I buy my ASW for.
This is the thread on there: http://www.masa.asn.au/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=163790&sid=fcd67d5ef691bc49a3629722ed1e3d5c
Don't get confused pool salt are not all the same, some certainly have added copper etc or are straight sodium chloride.
What the Sunray product discussed here is evaporated NSW.
From my reading earlier today there is going to be a proportion of the product that will not redissolve like calcium carbonate. Not sure what may happen with Mg etc.
Also these evap ponds can be full of bacteria and micro algae's etc so N and P may be an issue.
Testing after mixing will give the answers.
I did make up my own sea salt mix a while back using a recipe from Moe's 'the marine aquarium handbook'. I used $5 per 20kg water softener salt and added all the sulfates, Mg, Ca etc etc.
It worked out at around 6c ltr from memory and was very good, I would still be using it today the only thing stopping me is a lack of sufficient quality fresh water. Being on a farm all we have is rain water.
What the Sunray product discussed here is evaporated NSW.
From my reading earlier today there is going to be a proportion of the product that will not redissolve like calcium carbonate. Not sure what may happen with Mg etc.
Also these evap ponds can be full of bacteria and micro algae's etc so N and P may be an issue.
Testing after mixing will give the answers.
I did make up my own sea salt mix a while back using a recipe from Moe's 'the marine aquarium handbook'. I used $5 per 20kg water softener salt and added all the sulfates, Mg, Ca etc etc.
It worked out at around 6c ltr from memory and was very good, I would still be using it today the only thing stopping me is a lack of sufficient quality fresh water. Being on a farm all we have is rain water.
I don't have any metal test kits, I have the standard nitrite, nitrate, phos, Mg, ammonia, Calcium, alk, salinity, ph.
I'll buy a bag tonight if I can find the brand at my local bunnings and mix some up and test it all tomorrow evening.
I'm glad this has stimulated some interesting discussion. If I end up dying in an 'accident' someone can continue the experiment :P
I'll buy a bag tonight if I can find the brand at my local bunnings and mix some up and test it all tomorrow evening.
I'm glad this has stimulated some interesting discussion. If I end up dying in an 'accident' someone can continue the experiment :P
It will be interesting to see how this turns out...
My main concern would be where the sea water is collected from - do they stop collecting if there has been a lot of rain; do they only collect on a high tide? I doubt you would ever find out the answers to these questions but it could significantly effect the quality of the final product.
My main concern would be where the sea water is collected from - do they stop collecting if there has been a lot of rain; do they only collect on a high tide? I doubt you would ever find out the answers to these questions but it could significantly effect the quality of the final product.
I would certainly support the idea of testing the salt in a nano or something and tossing some life into it to see what happens over a period of time. *intrigued*
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