Reef Discussion

[chrisg_75]

Thanks for the words and the info ezza. Ill check them out. I do understand that sometimes get something crap is a total waste of money.

I am getting cash together to get ecoxotic LEDs for the tank so that is bit more of a priority than skimmer hence the decision to be made.

 

[aussieant32]

You know what honey. I don't think you should think like that. It's mildly frustrating to me that so many people on the various reef forums share this ideal that you "have" to have the -best- gadgets and nothing else is good enough. I know that obviously if you have endless funds, the sky is the limit... but I also think it is so important to encourage each other regardless of your hardware or budget. Why not just buy something you can afford for now, take advantage of the boost in functionality and then if and whne you feel you are wanting to take the next step up, do it at the right time for you.

People should remember why they are being brought together in places such as this, for the love of the hobby. A little bit of ingenuity never killed anyone. Worst case scenario, yeah you empty the tank a little more... I have been cruising through fish keeping with koi pond and tropical tank in a laughable way. I am always getting funny looks when I talk about what I do... but there is one guy at my local pet shop who shares my deep love for fish and despite my ridiculous tank- he still treats me with respect and I have learnt so much that I get away with keeping an "AquaStyle 126" which is the most ridiculous tiny 20L tank, fully stocked, I change the water once every 3 months, and my fish LOVE it.

My point being, just google around, find somehting you can afford, check out some reviews and if you want... give it a whirl. That's what I plan to do when I take the marine plunge. I've just been scared off for the 50th time. I am now thinking of getting the same tank as you and starting small.

No disrespect to any of the enormously knowledgable people around the forum... but can you help us n00bs a little and think back to when you had to wade through the rock pool, staring into the whitewater of the breakers looming larger than ever in front? I'm sure we've all been in the situation Chris is finding himself in now.

Just hold your breath and jump Chris... I'll be offside holding the floaties ready to follow you. We'll get there mate!

People are just giving experienced opinions :)

There is no point in buying a rubbish skimmer for a nano, you are much better just doing more frequent water changes. Noone is saying spend a fortune or get out of the hobby, in fact it is the complete opposite, we are giving an alternative to spending a single cent. Personally I think your advice of " check out some reviews and if you want... give it a whirl." is going to cost alot more than the previous advice of "if you can't afford it right now, you can get away with regular water changes to keep your nutrients down.
with smaller tanks sometimes that's all you need."

Everyone is trying to help everyone here, we all started in the same place and I fail to see anyone who is not trying to help here. What we are trying to do is stop Chris wasting his money on something that is not suitable. Why spend $100 now on a skimmer that won't actually benefit the tank at all when you can save up some money and buy one that will be of great benefit, my opinion anyway.

 

[ezza]

But I have to wonder if the cheaper skimmer didn't work at all... then why does it exist? Surely then noone would buy them and the company would cease to exist. It can't be -that- bad. There has to be a point (that I don't know) where a skimmer is functional and works, yet is not the best best best one. Do you understand what I mean? If the ONLY skimmer that worked was the Tunze... then why on earth is there even a choice? The link I found is a $50 skimmer yes, but would it even do half the job of the tunze, which might still mean the water might not need to be changed in such volume so frequently? Maybe he could change 10L once a week instead of 20L. To me, there is occasionally a time and place for going half way and settling for a medium term instead of going all the way at the start. I could easily budget for a $50 purchase, but the $200 option starts to eat into other expenses... It's just a matter of perspective. Surely there -has- to exist another option or two which happen to cost less. It is unreasonable that in the entire world, no other skimmer at all is worth buying, even if it only lasts 1 year, instead of 2. Most of the warranties are only 1 year anyhoo...

 

[aussieant32]

Yes it works, but more frequent water changes will be more beneficial for nutrient exporting. I am in no way and as far as I can recall have said the Tunze is the only option, it is the unit I recommend as I have personal experience with it.

My opinion is this makes it a waste of money, but that is just how I look it. You obviously are looking at it in a different way, best part of a forum is everyone gets to put their opinion forward.

 

[ezza]

oh absolutely! #aussieant32. I guess I am looking at it from the perspective that if, for example he wanted a skimmer for now, but would replace it within a year or two... what are the options. :) i'm also not saying you are saying tunze is the only option.. just using it as an example.

 

[chrisg_75]

I can understand both sides of the story and thank everyone for their input and trying to help. Please continue if there is more beneficial comments I'm always learning so all good.

Like I said I'm looking at getting the LEDs too so probably more focused if ancillary on those than the skimmer where as if they were not in the picture I would probably consider the tunze now.

 

[aussieant32]

I try and not give advice on something I do not have experience with. I had a $50 Hob skimmer once and it was junk, not to say they all are.

 

[MichaelBinns]

why buy equiptment, when you already know in the back of your mind you are not going to be happy with it and are already planning on upgrading it in a year before youve even purchased it, THATS a waste of money IMO, just do it right the first time, listen to what other people have to say from their experiences, take it all with a pinch of salt obviously, as everyone has their own opinions, do some of your own research, learn WHY some skimmers perform different to others, and then combine all the info together and make your own judgement.

 

[rockerpeller]

I would stand by the Tunze due to the size constraints. That and they have been proven on this exact same tank model.
Sure there are other skimmers out there, but like @aussieant32 has said, how much money has to be wasted just to end up with the Tunze, or more waterchanges.
I mean every skimmer has its pros and cons. Most of the time, it is the cheaper skimmers that will cause you more grief.
From personal experience and what I've read, you really can't beat a stone skimmer on a small tank. Providing you don't mind having to replace the stone regularly, getting an airpump with a rheostat, and modifying the rear wall of the tank just to make it fit.
The cheaper pump venturI style skimmers are generally hard to tune, put out way to many microbubbles, and aren't efficient at waste export to justify buying them. What keeps them around are people trying to get into this hobby on the cheap, and not researching the skimmer before purchase.
Now don't get me wrong. There are some stunning tanks done cheaply, but finding these are few and far between.

Now the question would be, are you willing to save a few dollars and try something a lot of other people have tried just to find it doesn't work as it should Or go the tried and true way that a lot of people wished they had done at the start.
Like I originally said, for what space constraints you have, the Tunze it's the only way I would personally go. If funds didn't permit, I would rely on waterchanges.

Another thing you have to remember though is a skimmer doesn't give you a green light to lax on your waterchanges. Whether you have a top dollar skimmer or a cheap one, nothing beats nutrient export like waterchanges. Skimmers are for getting crap out of the water, not replacing the elements that are used up.
Another mistake is to think "That's ok, I'll dose all the elements that are low". Yea that will get all the elements back up, but that's only for the elements we test. there are still a lot of trace elements we don't test for that will need to be replenished.

Sorry for the extremely long post ( I think its my longest post on this site :p ) but I had to put all this across so you have an informed decision rather then letting you do the same mistakes I did when I 1st started (yes I was one of the poor buggers that got a few of the cheap skimmers).
I hope you'll find some of this info helpful.

 

[MichaelBinns]

speaking of cheap skimmers, i still have my first 2 sitting in the garage, so if anyone wants to give it a go feel free to come blow the dust of mine, honestly tho its not worth it, i understand some people have different budgets etc, i can relate to that as i purchased all my equiptment on apprentice wages, i can honestly say i wish i didn't waste the money on the cheaper items to start with, even tho i got the tank wet 2/3 weeks earlier, wasnt worth it, cant even re sell them they are that bad, unless you take advantage of some poor n00b

 

[chrisg_75]

Again thanks for all the advice and comments. I am still doing my weekly water changes and will keep doing them irrespective of what I get when.

I do know the Tunze is the best skimmer and hence why I am on the look out for a 2nd hand one if it arises, however I am focused on the LEDs as the main upgrade at the moment and minimising the output for the skimmer.

 

[ezza]

Boys, you have -now- made me happy. Just the sort of conversation I was hoping for :)

 

[MichaelBinns]

not sure if forum drama queen and enjoys heated discussions or if genuinly pleased with what was said lol

 

[aussieant32]

Lets talk LED's now..

 

[MichaelBinns]

il leave you to it, dont know enough to have an opinion here :P

 

[ezza]

call me a drama queen if you like, i'm not... but go ahead... i just wanted people to actually discuss the issue and share all the options instead of just stopping with the conclusions everyone has already reached. some of us don't have the pre-existing knowledge and would like to understand the steps to the end result.

 

[MichaelBinns]

just dont know what to make of you yet, especially considoring our first chat earlier, so forgive me for thinking you just enjoy it.

 

[chrisg_75]

Is there anywhere else I'm likely to find a second hand tunze 9002 anyone ? Is this the best place to look for gear ?

 

[ezza]

roflmao :P your window kept popping up and down, it was annoying!!! i was trying to figure you out too. correcting your spelling was my way of figuring you out. people either get seriously pissed off by it, or they don't care. you seem to be mostly the latter, which is nice. i didn't mean anything by it.

we can talk building sometime! i need to hang gyprock in my little art studio in my backyard. i created a japanese garden (of sorts) and this is the last, but most ambitious (and expensive) bit. in the last month i dug a 13m long trench across my backyard for the sparkies to lay conduit to the cabin from the back of my garage. hopefully i can get that done in the next couple weeks. i was waiting for the hiusband to get back from overseas- i'll round up the family to come and help get the walls done. none of us have ever done it, but i've been talked through the process and it makes sense for the most part. i'm one of the only handy ones, matt's family aren't all that tool oriented but for his uncle who is an engineer... but they're all tall so at least i won't be needing ladders! :D

 

[MichaelBinns]

tried any other forums??